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Author Topic: Ammo ban ideas
Rudy
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Due to the subject of a State Department ammunition ban, as reported here, It would be wise for us to start planning ways around the ban.

I'm starting this thread so we can discuss contingency plans, goals and methods to obtain those goals.

Goal: For each unit, or county to become self sufficient in producing ammunition.

I think that is something that we can all agree on.

Let me make some assumptions based on the original article.
  • 1. The ban seems to be focused on military rifle calibers such as 5.56/.223, 7.62x39, and 7.62x51. Later the ban will include handgun calibers like 9mm, .45 ACP.
    2. This will drive the cost of those calibers to new record high prices. I predict up to $2.00 per round.
    3. Those calibers will become scarce as all domestic production will be sold to the government.
    4. Black markets will suddenly appear as prices rise to new highs and availability disappears. Shipments will go missing from the plants. Semi tractors will be hijacked.

Now what can we do to lessen the effects of this ban? The obvious answer is to make our own ammunition. To do this we need to set up our own facilities.

Let’s discuss ways to go about obtaining this goal.

--------------------
Rudy out
"Once the pin is pulled, Mr. Handgrenade is no longer our friend."

Posts: 2113 | From: 43BN-37FF | Registered: Feb 2004  | Report this post to a Moderator
Flight-ER-Doc
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It's not hard, and costs can be as low as a few cents per round. I have such a 'facility' and have been reloading for 25+ years..

A new bullet, a little powder, a primer is all it takes to take your (saved, recovered) brass and make it go boom again.

--------------------
Emergency Medicine - saving the world from themselves, one at a time.

"Thou shalt not be a victim, thou shalt not be a perpetrator, but, above all, thou shalt not be a bystander."

I make the ADL soil themselves. And that makes me very happy :)

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Tsalagi123
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What is the bare minimum of what someone would need to start reloading? How much of an investment in equipment?
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airforce
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quote:
Originally posted by Tsalagi123:
What is the bare minimum of what someone would need to start reloading? How much of an investment in equipment?

How does $21.99 sound?

I don't know how many thousands of rounds I've reloaded with the Lee Loader. I still have it, but I don't use it any more. Once you start, and realize your handloads are better than the factory ammo you buy, you're going to want to invest in more dies, a digital scale, a tumbler, a progressive loader...

Onward and upward,
airforce

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Texas Resistance
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You can get by with a Lee loader for pistol rounds but rilfe brass stretches every time it is fired. A lot of rifles have blown up from firing untrimmed brass.

--------------------
www.TexasMilitia.Info “Seek out and join a lawful Militia or form one in your area. If you wish to remain Free you will have to fight for it...because the traitors will give us no choice in the matter” William Cooper

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Flight-ER-Doc
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quote:
Originally posted by airforce:
quote:
Originally posted by Tsalagi123:
What is the bare minimum of what someone would need to start reloading? How much of an investment in equipment?

How does $21.99 sound?

I don't know how many thousands of rounds I've reloaded with the Lee Loader. I still have it, but I don't use it any more. Once you start, and realize your handloads are better than the factory ammo you buy, you're going to want to invest in more dies, a digital scale, a tumbler, a progressive loader...

Onward and upward,
airforce

A Lee Loader will do it...a single-stage press is faster and will do more rifle calibers. You can get an RCBS Rockchucker with a set of dies for a caliber, and everything else you need in the way of hardware, for around $300. A pound of powder is around $20-25 and primers are about $0.03 each.

To figure how many rounds you can get from a pound of powder divide 7,000 grains (1 lb) by the weight of each charge: For a .308 a very average load would be 40 or so grains of IMR-3031 powder (a very general purpose rifle powder) with a 150 gr spitzer bullet generating maybe 2600 or 2700 FPS at the muzzle. So, 7000/40 = 175 and at a powder cost of around $0.13 or a bit less, you're set. Bullets cost around a nickle on up, depending.

So, since you already have the brass (the most expensive part) your cost per round reloaded is around $0.20 or $0.21. Pretty good, I'd say. And except in magnum, full power loads, brass can easily be reloaded 3 or 4 times, I've got some .416 Rigby (each roun about the size of a carrot) brass (from Norma) that has been reloaded 9 times so far (I carefully check for any signs of stretch, including measuring the web thickness). Sort of an experiment of mine, and I'd never use that brass for hunting [Smile]

Of course, you can go wild with accessories, too: Tumblers, chronographs, exotic powders. But for almost everything IMR-3031 for rifles, and Unique for pistols will work: Lots will work better, but these are the Chevy Pickup powders: They'll get most anything not too weird done.

Reloading gives you the options of tailoring a specific precision load to the rifle you're using, too: To eke the last tenth of an MOA out of it.

If you're loading a lot a progressive press (like from Dillon Precision) is the thing to have - 1 pull of the lever and 3 or 4 steps are done at once.

--------------------
Emergency Medicine - saving the world from themselves, one at a time.

"Thou shalt not be a victim, thou shalt not be a perpetrator, but, above all, thou shalt not be a bystander."

I make the ADL soil themselves. And that makes me very happy :)

Posts: 1949 | From: Slipping the surly bonds of earth | Registered: Dec 2004  | Report this post to a Moderator
Tsalagi123
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So basically I just need the press, a scale, and materials? Doesn't sound too bad over all. It's something to look into.
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Flight-ER-Doc
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Dies for each caliber. A few little things that make life a lot easier.

This is pretty much what I got started with all those years ago:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=646599

Still works just fine [Smile]

--------------------
Emergency Medicine - saving the world from themselves, one at a time.

"Thou shalt not be a victim, thou shalt not be a perpetrator, but, above all, thou shalt not be a bystander."

I make the ADL soil themselves. And that makes me very happy :)

Posts: 1949 | From: Slipping the surly bonds of earth | Registered: Dec 2004  | Report this post to a Moderator
Rudy
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Lets assume that we have the press and dies needed for our calibers. Powder, primers and bullets won't be for sale on the open market anymore.

How do we go about making these?

I know about swaging, as my friends and I have a press for this.

The powder and primers are going to be next to impossible unless I'm over looking something.

Does anyone know how to manufacture their own powder and primers?

[ 03-06-2009, 08:38 AM: Message edited by: Rudy ]

--------------------
Rudy out
"Once the pin is pulled, Mr. Handgrenade is no longer our friend."

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Flight-ER-Doc
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quote:
Originally posted by Rudy:
Lets assume that we have the press and dies needed for our calibers. Powder, primers and bullets won't be for sale on the open market anymore.

How do we go about making these?

I know about swaging, as my friends and I have a press for this.

The powder and primers are going to be next to impossible unless I'm over looking something.

Stock up now. Primers, especially, will be difficult to make.

Back in the early 1990's there was a more or less manufactured 'primer shortage' when the dems first passed the AWB - the fear was that they were going to include some sort of arsenal provision that would make having more than x amount of ammo very, very expensive.

So, lots of people bought primers. Prices went up, supply went down.

When things got back to normal, I started buying primers (they store just fine in an ammo can in a cool place). And 10,000 primers doesn't begin to fill a .50 cal can. At this point I've got two 20mm cans just about full [Smile]

Powder is much more bulky to store, but it stores well too: just keep it cool and dry. It can be purchased in 1lb bottles or 8 lb kegs, I prefer the bottles since once I open it it gets used faster. And they fit in 20mm cans too.

--------------------
Emergency Medicine - saving the world from themselves, one at a time.

"Thou shalt not be a victim, thou shalt not be a perpetrator, but, above all, thou shalt not be a bystander."

I make the ADL soil themselves. And that makes me very happy :)

Posts: 1949 | From: Slipping the surly bonds of earth | Registered: Dec 2004  | Report this post to a Moderator
C. M. Wolf
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quote:
Originally posted by Rudy:

The powder and primers are going to be next to impossible unless I'm over looking something.

Does anyone know how to manufacture their own powder and primers?

Yes, I have the "knowledge" to make my own powders and primers,(though not the equipment, materials, and chemicals for them).

The chemicals it takes to mfg'r smokeless rifle powders is quite "guarded" and not cheap. Even the basic chemicals to make the ingredients for the single stage, double stage,(this is the most common used for rifle powders), and triple stage powders,(commonly known as "Ball Powders"), can be a somewhat complicated process to put together.
The most guarded of these ingredients are "Nitroocellulose",(single stage, or 'guncotton'), and "Nitroglycerin" added/mixed to the guncotton to form (double stage), powders. Added to the Double Stage Mix is "Nitroguanidine",(to form the Triple Stage Powders), and then these mixes are specially "Corned" into it's shape to form balls,(which is a specific process all by itself), or extruded into cylinders or flakes to guage the certain burn rates of the certain powders used for certain cals/ballistics.

Even once the single stage and double stage powders are properly mixed with the necessary ingredients that keep the powders from burning out the rifle bbls too fast and those that help keep them stable in handling, the compounds must be properly "Sized" into grains that actually "Gauge" the proper burn rates for the rounds that they will be used in or intended for. The most complicated part of mfg'ing rifle powders is the "Mixing for the Degree of Heat During Burn" in the powders themselves. If the mix isn't correct, the ID of the bbl will burn out quickly rendering the firearm inaccurate or useless, or the ballsitics can be inaccurate, unstable, or underpowered for the intended results.

The processes are quite a science for the powders alone, which require quite a few safguards for the whole process.

The primers are a bit easier in that the old primers can be "reused" by removing/cleaning the anvils, cleaning/reshaping the primer cups and reassembling them. them the primer mix and recharging the primer cups isn't quite as complicated as mfg'ing the rifle powders. This mix is generally done "wet" and allowed to dry after being pressed/squeezed into the primer cups. The Primer Mix is quite similar to the chemicals that are found in 'strike anywhere matches'. It's simply an "igniter" that flashes off the rifle powder in the bullet casing. (It might not be a bad thing to save your old/used primers that are removed from the fired casings.)

...

Two other "hurdles" that may need to eventually be overcome will be making "new" casings and "new" bullet/projectiles. These require certain "Alloys" in the brass that makes the casing and in the copper that form the jackets of the bullets,(and depending on the cals, even in the lead cores in the bullets).

Not to mention the equipment required to properly "Form" and measure the casings and assemble the bullets in a most uniformed process.

...

Frankly, I think it would be just as easy to "Right every Wrong" in our government that keeps quality mfgr'ed ammo from being available and affordable to "We The People". But that IS the "original hurdle" here, isn't? This would be quite an undertaking without enlisting the expertiese of the 'specialists' that know how to and what to avoid, rather than beginning these things from "Square One" along with the 'trial and error' that goes with it!
Especially considering the PTB will be actively/agressively seeking any "Pirate Mfgr" of these things just as they would some 'high level enemy terrorist'!

...

But, these things can be made correctly, and safely, and accurately by private Citizens, because that IS the case and always has been! Governments merely contract and regulate the hell of the private companies that now make these things.
I would also think that IF such a venture were to be required by the American Militia, a "Uniformed Caliber/Round" would be quite necessary throughout the whole Nation just so that the many different cals can be kept to a minimum, making the mfg processes simpler. (Of course, this is also "why" certain cals are being targeted as being 'restricted',{or made scarce}, by the PTB in this country, also).

IMHO (Sigh)

Michael

This Post Is Intended For "Instructional Purposes" ONLY!

[ 03-06-2009, 11:40 AM: Message edited by: C. M. Wolf ]

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Bona_na_Croin
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Some questions to go along with this subject

1. Primers

If you are going to store a large quantity for a rainy day do any precautions need to be in place for long term storage? Besides the obvious keep them dry. Do they deteriorate at all with age by themselves? Would placing them in a dry bag and sealed with oxygen absorbers be of any benefit?

2. Powder

What is the shelf life of different powders? Does oxygen affect it at all?

3. Casings and various projectiles

what types of metals are needed? I don't know the manufacturing process to achieve different alloys but if someone did it before, it could be done in the future. So if a quantity of various metals were available to make these alloys, what would they be and how could they be found easily in the common household or business?

--------------------
Bona na Croin- Neither Collar nor Crown

"Free where I live or die where I stand"

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C. M. Wolf
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Simply put...
I would be more inclined to vote we just take what ammo that we now have, and just shoot the anti-American bastards or take some rope and hang them that are doing everything they can to tear down America and remove our Inlienable Rights from us!!

IMHO

Michael

[ 03-06-2009, 10:47 AM: Message edited by: C. M. Wolf ]

--------------------
"Argue for your limitations, and in the end, when all is said and done, they're your's!"

"Sheeple & Shepherds, pick one! You can't be both no matter how you dress."

The higher ya go... the higher ya can get! Mountain Men Rock!

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Bona_na_Croin
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Some questions to go along with this subject

1. Primers

If you are going to store a large quantity for a rainy day do any precautions need to be in place for long term storage? Besides the obvious keep them dry. Do they deteriorate at all with age by themselves? Would placing them in a dry bag and sealed with oxygen absorbers be of any benefit?

2. Powder

What is the shelf life of different powders? Does oxygen affect it at all?

3. Casings and various projectiles

what types of metals are needed? I don't know the manufacturing process to achieve different alloys but if someone did it before, it could be done in the future. So if a quantity of various metals were available to make these alloys, what would they be and how could they be found easily in the common household or business?

--------------------
Bona na Croin- Neither Collar nor Crown

"Free where I live or die where I stand"

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C. M. Wolf
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quote:
Originally posted by Bona_na_Croin:
Some questions to go along with this subject

1. Primers

If you are going to store a large quantity for a rainy day do any precautions need to be in place for long term storage? Besides the obvious keep them dry. Do they deteriorate at all with age by themselves? Would placing them in a dry bag and sealed with oxygen absorbers be of any benefit?

2. Powder

What is the shelf life of different powders? Does oxygen affect it at all?

3. Casings and various projectiles

what types of metals are needed? I don't know the manufacturing process to achieve different alloys but if someone did it before, it could be done in the future. So if a quantity of various metals were available to make these alloys, what would they be and how could they be found easily in the common household or business?

Primer Storage-
These can be kept for a very long time without degredation. They should be kept cool, dry, well sealed, and away from light and with minimum vibration as possible. "Static-Charge Free Environments are HIGHLY recommended".

Powder Storage-
"Improved Rifle Powders" need to be rotated about every ten years or so as these can chemically breakdown due to their main ingredient- Nitroglycerin. If these powders,(loaded into bullets or intended storage containers), are kept well sealed, cool, dry, away from light, and vibration, can be stored for as long as 4 times the recommened "Shelf Life". This still can be a caution with certain powders and loaded rounds as there are many variables with this that make this aspect of long term storage quite a caution,(you really need to "Know" what you have and who & how it was made AND handled throughout it's life before it came to you). "Static-Charge Free Environments are HIGHLY recommended".
(As a note; "Factory Loaded Ammo" can be made from inferior components,{including and especially the powders}, where the mfg'r takes "Special Precautions and Measurements" to guage the specific "Loads" being made when the round is assembled.)

**Both the above materials are recommended kept in fire-proof containers with a "purposely designed weak surface or wall" in case of "accident" for safety reasons.**

Casings and Bullet Alloys-

Most common in casings is Brass, other alloys include copper, tin, and sometimes a small quantity of nickle. The specific "Blend" of these alloys are what makes the casings function correctly and last for their specific intended purposes with as little 'problems" as possible.
In the Bullet Jackets, the most common metal used is Soft Copper, and sometimes alloyed with tin, brass, and once... nickle,(using nickle in the alloy mix forms what was once called "German Silver", but this tended to wear the bores faster than wished so Copper is now the main metal in bullet jackets. Nickle was later totally removed from bullet alloys due to excessive wear and plating the interiors of rifle chambers which possibly caused higher than intended CUP pressuers or other failures in rifles). Solid or Cast "Lead" bullets are rarely ever used together with IMRs,(Double or Triple Stage powders), because the power in these powders tended to strip lead from the bullet as it traveled down the rifled bores instead of the rifling creating the "Spin" on the lead projectiles,(lead by itself is generally too soft for IMRs and the rifling simply shaved the bullets before they effected a proper twist-rate on the projectile through the bore. Using solid lead bullets with IMRs also was eliminated due to "Lead-Binding" in the bores which possibly caused higher CUP pressures as more rounds were fired through the rifle).

In finding these specific "Metals", the "purist forms" of them are best. But this is not manditory. The amount of alloys used in any parts of the Rifle Round should be consistant throughout any process, and throughout all "Batches" of ammo that is made. Otherwise accuracy and consistancy becomes more than a "Nightmare".

IHTH

Michael

[ 03-06-2009, 01:21 PM: Message edited by: C. M. Wolf ]

--------------------
"Argue for your limitations, and in the end, when all is said and done, they're your's!"

"Sheeple & Shepherds, pick one! You can't be both no matter how you dress."

The higher ya go... the higher ya can get! Mountain Men Rock!

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Rudy
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I think I'm pretty well set for the bullets. I've standardized on the 5.56 round. My friends have a CORBIN swager. We can manufacture our own bullets. We've got maybe 100,000 .22lr cases and 3000 pounds of pure lead. It's a slow tedious process, but we have done it in the past.

I've heard it is possible to reload the primers, and is quite easy if you have the correct chemicals.

It's the powder that has me concerned. It would be nice if we each had an uncle that worked at Lake City. Short of stealing the government's powder, how do we get our own powder?

--------------------
Rudy out
"Once the pin is pulled, Mr. Handgrenade is no longer our friend."

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C. M. Wolf
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quote:
Originally posted by Rudy:
...

It's the powder that has me concerned. It would be nice if we each had an uncle that worked at Lake City. Short of stealing the government's powder, how do we get our own powder?

THAT is the "Ticket",(so to speak), and also "WHY" the U.S. Government was suing the "Dupont Heir",(and threatening to lock him up in an asylum for the rest of his life), for all those years during the clinton admin.... because they HAD to have the Dupont IMR mfg'ing plants Moved out of the United States so that the feds could totally control those powders from coming into civilians hands without requiring any VOTES by anyone!!!

All aspects of IMR mfging is now controled, even so much as it's most basic elements to create the "Ingredients" that make these powders! You would have to make/create/mine/farm your own chemicals and elements just to begin making your own ingredients... to mfgr your own IMR Powders... once you have established the correct/safe "Processes" to begin Mixing them.

...And if I may mention... again, "All the while you are being hunted by the PTB for mfgr'ing a Class 1.3 Explosive as a Pirate/Terrorist without permission by the very PTB that have gone to very great lengths,(for decades), to keep these things from YOU."

(But other than that... count me in.)

*Sigh*

Michael

[ 03-06-2009, 11:29 AM: Message edited by: C. M. Wolf ]

--------------------
"Argue for your limitations, and in the end, when all is said and done, they're your's!"

"Sheeple & Shepherds, pick one! You can't be both no matter how you dress."

The higher ya go... the higher ya can get! Mountain Men Rock!

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Kunkmiester
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Black markets are everywhere. Make sure there's a chain of people who know people, and that they can get a hold of what's needed when needed. Also store the capital that will be needed to start and continue the process.
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goinpostal
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I wonder how hard it would be to manufacture"Trounds",but in a more conventional brass cartridge shape so they could be used in a regular firearm.You would think with the advances in injection molded polymers that something like that would have hit the shelves by now.Building an injection mold would be easier than trying to manufacture brass casings from scratch.It seems to me that if an all plastic 2 shot dbl bbl assasin pistol can be made,then it shouldnt be to hard to come up with a disposable plastic cased cartridge 25yrs later.

--------------------
I want to die in my sleep just like my Grandpa.Not yellin and screamin like the passengers in his car.

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shooter19802003
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Manufacturing brass cases isn't that hard. A lot of african hunters and folks that shoot odd balls do it all the time. It is just time consuming.
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J. Croft
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Have you read any old books on turning out a rifle cartridge? You need several multi-ton presses for any production run. Which require a lot of power, take up a lot of space, make a lot of noise-got all that covered in a way that would make it undetectable?

One option is to go the way of the meth dealer/businessman on Breaking Bad; have laundromats and fast food franchise and at the laundromat have a secert compartment underneath one of the laundry machines and below is a meth lab. Or a fully functional ammunition plant-IF you can justify the raw materials being ordered.

--------------------
Be your own leader

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Rudy
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If you need bullet jackets, there are tons of companies that can stamp out thousands of them in just minutes.

I used to check out the hard cover editions of the THOMAS REGISTER for these manufacturers. There is no need to tell them what they are manufacturing. For all they need to know is that it is the top of a ball point pen, or part of a toggle switch.

Subcontract it out if you can't do it.

--------------------
Rudy out
"Once the pin is pulled, Mr. Handgrenade is no longer our friend."

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J. Croft
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Bullet jackets can be mistaken for something else. Cartridge cases are another matter as it would take a full blown retard to see an extractor rim or a necked down piece of brass and not think it was a cartidge casing being manufactured surreptitiously.

Making them in a gun-friendly plastic with metal extractor rims/primer holders would be better, but you'd most likely need a specific blend of plastics and chemicals and would still have to come up with ways to acquire such chemicals under ruse or find a recipe using plastic items far too common to ever hopefully track down/ban.

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Posts: 1535 | From: somewhere-where am I? | Registered: Feb 2007  | Report this post to a Moderator
Rudy
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If you would buy them now when there are no restrictions on them it sure would make things easier in the future.

We looked at buying some from the military at a auction. Due to the ammo shortage the price skyrocketed. Last year's auction saw 1.5 million 5.56 cases go for $675. This year's auction had 1.7 million cases of 5.56 and 3 million 9mm cases and the auction ended at $36,000!

Now that ammo is again becoming available the price should start to fall again.

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Posts: 2113 | From: 43BN-37FF | Registered: Feb 2004  | Report this post to a Moderator
J. Croft
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If you can buy brass now-do it.

Just remember our situation will be like the Boers; limited amount of rifles, limited stocks of ammunition and supplies for reloading with NO prospects for acquiring more save for battlefield captures... you have to win and and be able to make off with them first.

To think you can get by on what brass, lead and powder you can acquire now without thinking of the means to manufacture whole cartridges from scratch will lead to defeat. A Boer would tell you.

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Posts: 1535 | From: somewhere-where am I? | Registered: Feb 2007  | Report this post to a Moderator
Rudy
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Brass is easily obtainable now, but will be impossible to get once the defication hits the oscilation.

Bullets we have the ability and equipment available today to produce what we need. Get the equipment and supplies NOW.

Powder: We have no way to produce this now and it doesn't look any brighter in the future. Stockpile what you think you'll need. Make group buys with friends. I have a friend that orders 4 'cans' at a time; 55-gallon cans.

Primers: Supposedly there is a way to reload these, but I have yet to locate anyone that is familar with it. You'll need to stockpile these also. Set up an automatic purchase program with a local supplier*.

* Set up an arrangement with a local supplier. If he can give you a good deal, you'd be willing to buy 4 boxes a month. Offer to pay for them up front. You'll have a good supplier, and he'll have steady sales.

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Rudy out
"Once the pin is pulled, Mr. Handgrenade is no longer our friend."

Posts: 2113 | From: 43BN-37FF | Registered: Feb 2004  | Report this post to a Moderator
J. Croft
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Brass might be made out of tubing, I remember vaguely a Shotgun News of the Serb Prizi Partizan arsenal where they use that method. Plastic cased rounds are being produced now and there's no reason why a formula from commonly found plastic can't be made up. Of course the machinery and tooling will have to be designed... NOW from commonly available parts.

Powder: why not a substitute for smokeless powder that can roughly deliver the performance without so much the processing effort? Ammopulvar with something to raise the temperature it starts to leak out...

Primers are basically minute bits of primary explosive. Someone experimented with a piezoelectric primer and found it took an injection of gas before inserting the primer for reliable ignition.

So, sooner or later someone will have to think out of the box and come up with a cartidge-less means of putting lead on target.

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Posts: 1535 | From: somewhere-where am I? | Registered: Feb 2007  | Report this post to a Moderator
Breacher
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Consider the utility of alternative weapons altogether.

If you compare Polish resistance techniques vs the French Maqis, the Polish frequently successfully raised the fatality rates of collaborators and enemy troops through alternative means which left enough issues to question that retaliation by the gestapo was less common or effective. The French were not as effective, and many French units never became particularly active until liberation by allied forces was imminent.

One element of the alternatives was hoarding and stockpiling firearms, but not using them much in day to day resistance operations. Sabotage against vehicles, vehicle theft and car bombings were used, as were various methods of killing done in ways that would look like suicide. An apparently common CIA technique is to simply toss the victim off a tall building and call it a suicide. Then there were building fires (Nazi party members in Poland had this problem with gas mains igniting, and coal chutes catching fire), then food poisoning, arsenic somehow getting mixed in with food (whoda thunk).

What it gets back to if you want your AKs, FALs, and ARs running, is stockpiled, smuggled and captured ammo.

The new technology can make functional subguns and midrange assault type weapons, but nothing has really given us a functional replacement for powder burners when it comes to compact powerful handguns or long range rifles.

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Posts: 6705 | From: Western States | Registered: Sep 2002  | Report this post to a Moderator
noname762
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quote:
Originally posted by shooter19802003:
Manufacturing brass cases isn't that hard. A lot of african hunters and folks that shoot odd balls do it all the time. It is just time consuming.

Why couldn't bullet moulds be made so one could cast his own like I sometimes did when I had muzzleloaders?

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Grass fed Beef..it's what's fer supper July 4th.

Posts: 608 | From: behind enemy lines | Registered: Jul 2009  | Report this post to a Moderator
   

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